Hi brian!
Thanks for your commentary and your on going work on books, the Perl
Review=
,=20
your Perl code, etc.
See below for my response. Sorry for the long email.
On Tuesday 17 April 2007, brian d foy wrote:
> In article <200704161034.00930.shlomif@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>, Shlomi Fish
>
> <shlomif@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> > 2. One cannot effectively contribute it. (I offered my help to revamp
i=
t,
> > but BDFOY said I couldn't).
>
> I missed this part earlier, but Shlomi, I'm going to have to call you a
> liar again, and remind you that this is why you are having problems
> with people.
>
> I don't have anything to do with learn.perl.org, so there's absolutely
> no way that I could give or withhold permission for you to do anything
> with it. Furthermore, I never said that you couldn't or shouldn't
> contribute. I have exerted no influence to deny any activity of yours.
>
> I have, however, pointed out when you have not been honest, just as I
> am doing here.
>
> As I have told you many times before, you don't need anyone's
> permission to do anything. Make the Perl beginner's site that you think
> should exist, and stop worrying about some official blessing or what
> anyone else is doing.
You can label me as a "liar" as "dishonest" or as anything you want. I
no=20
longer mind, because you've already called me a liar once, and so it has
lo=
st=20
its initial affect. Not to mention that many geeks have a tendency to
abuse=
=20
this word, so I always take it with a grain of salt.
Here's some advice though: calling someone a liar is a very strong
label,=20
which immediately causes this person to think you're hurting his
feelings,=
=20
and causes others to think you're trying to make a hyperbole. There are
muc=
h=20
better words: "inaccuracies", "not exactly", "not entirely correct",
perhap=
s=20
even "mis-information" or "dis-information".
I am a honest person. If you go to http://www.shlomifish.org/
or STFW
me,=20
you'll find links to many things of value that I created on my free time,
a=
nd=20
made available for public consumption under very liberal licences.
However,=
=20
I'm still human, and don't always perceive the facts accurately, and
don't=
=20
always convey them accurately. You and I are as susceptible to it as
anyone=
=20
else. I'm not doing it on purpose, but labelling me as a liar, won't
help=20
keep the record straight. Instead saying:
<<<<<<<<<
Hi Shlomi!
> Quoty quote
That's not quite accurate. The real picture is $explanation.
Best Regards,
brian d. foy
>>>>>>>>>
What I said was that the source code for http://learn.perl.org/
is not=20
publically or privately available. There are some things that I'd like
to=20
remedy, but so far am unable to do so. Is that true? And no, I'm not
talkin=
g=20
about writing a new site from scratch - I've already been doing it for
the=
=20
past few years. This is like saying that in order to fix a bug in Oracle,
I=
=20
should implement all the Oracle feature-set, with the bug there fixed,
as=20
open-source myself. And it especially doesn't help that there are many=20
applications that work only with Oracle.
I hope I didn't make a false analogy here. I realise everyone is free
to=20
contribute. And I also hope that I can convince the webmasters of
prominent=
=20
Perl ****tals to link to Perl-Begin and recommend it. But getting help
from=
=20
the official perl.org people would also help a lot.
As for not being liked: I'm fully aware that I have had some bad
reputation=
in=20
the Perl world ( http://use.perl.org/~Shlomi
Fish/journal/24040 for
many=20
links). However, I'm not optimising for being liked by everybody. There
are=
=20
some people I became friends for, and what they think about me is the
most=
=20
im****tant. And I also noticed that with some people who I believed to had
a=
=20
grudge about me, I became good friends with after working together. For=20
example, Ask Bj=F8rn Hansen and I learned to like each other, after I did
a=
lot=20
of work on XML::RSS before my TPF grant and as part of it.
So I'm trying not to have prejudice and be judgemental of others. As
people=
=20
say "To err is human, to forgive - divine". I also say that to apologise
is=
=20
divine.
Another im****tant pattern is for me to do the things I find to be of the
mo=
st=20
value and contribution to myself and others. And sometimes it means not=20
saying what everybody likes to hear. I'm trying my best to say it in the
mo=
st=20
tactful way possible, but it doesn't always work. I'm trying to learn from
=
my=20
mistakes, and I seem to get better in some respects, but I'm still not=20
perfect. Some people are mostly naturally tactful (Linus Torvalds and
Larry=
=20
Wall are my tactfulness gods), and some people are not as good or
completel=
y=20
awful at that. But everyone can and should try to improve, and I'm no=20
exception.
Where was I? Ah yes. Nevertheless, I'm not optimising for being liked
or=20
loved. I'm optimising for being respected and admired. And like I said,=20
calling otherwise honest, productive, people who were not deliberately=20
lying "liars" is not going to increase one's likability karma.=20
=2D---------------
I'm sorry that you found what I said to be inaccurate, but I would
apprecia=
te=20
any factual corrections. What I meant was that learn.perl.org was:
1. Considered the official Perl ****tal.
2. Very hard to contribute to, as its source code was not made available.
3. Is worse on most respects than Perl-Begin.
4. I offered to help remedy learn.perl.org, but it was not accepted.
These (except perhaps #3 which is debatable) are the facts as I see them.
I=
f I=20
got them wrong, please feel free to correct me.
In any case, I'll contact Andy about getting hosting for Perl-Begin. It
wou=
ld=20
certainly be a productive and proactive thing to do. Then I'll also try
to=
=20
get more people to link there, which is also a productive action.
Best Regards,
Shlomi Fish
=2D--------------------------------------------------------------------
Shlomi Fish shlomif@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.shlomifish.org/
If it's not in my E-mail it doesn't happen. And if my E-mail is saying
one thing, and everything else says something else - E-mail will conquer.
-- An Israeli Linuxer
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