On Apr 21, 6:33=A0pm, t...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Thomas A. Russ) wrote:
> "matthewoconnor1...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
" <matthewoconnor1...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
wr=
ites:
> > Hi
>
> > We have been working on a Mac version of a java based desktop video
> > tagging product, and are coming slightly unstuck on UI design. We've
> > changed the UI and I'd be really interested/grateful to get your
> > feedback, comments and suggestions for improvement.
>
> > I'll elaborate a bit here to explain where we are at. This was
> > originally written as a Windows product, =A0but was picked up by
Apple.
> > As I'm sure you'll recognise, its written in Java and as such will
> > naturally suffer in comparison to other native Mac products in the
> > video arena. The plan is to rewrite in Cocoa, but commercially
> > speaking, we need a bit more traction with what we've got to justify
> > the cost, and obviously to ensure the improved user logic and ease of
> > use are correct before we green light the rewriting.
>
> > The thinking is that if the design is right for the Mac, we can
> > replicate if for the PC.
>
> > So I'm effectively asking you how to cosmetically enhance YourView-
> > written in Java- to appeal to a Mac audience with a view to ****ting
> > that to Windows.
>
> Well, the most challenging thing, as far a Java applications ****ted to
> Windows is concerned, is to get the menu setup correct. =A0There are a
> number of differences, which range from the trivial ("Preferences..." on
> the Mac, "Preferences" on Windows), to more fundamental: =A0A single,
> application-wide menu.
>
> There is information about ****ting available on the Mac developers site,
> as well as other Java-related web site. =A0Apple, in particular, has
some
> sample code and Adapter cl***** to make this a bit easier:
>
> <http://developer.apple.com/samplecode/OSXAdapter/index.html>
>
>
<http://developer.apple.com/do***entation/Java/Conceptual/Java14Develo...>=
>
>
<http://developer.apple.com/do***entation/Java/Conceptual/Java14Develo...>=
>
> The open-source VassalEngine (http://www.vassalengine.org/)
project has
> been working on getting Mac-style menus to work, but it has proven
> rather trickier than Apple's do***entation would suggest. =A0The hard
part=
> is that if you use multiple JFrames in your application, you have to
> make sure they all have a JMenuBar that has the same content -- but it
> has to be a different object, since menu bars can't be shared. =A0There
> were also some issues related to dialogs as well that were problematic.
> It has pretty much required a re-write of the entire menu-handling
> system for that particular application in order for it to work properly.
>
> There are also other behavioral aspects, such as Mac applications
> remaining active and running, even if their last window has been
> closed. =A0You need to quit the application to get it to go away, not
just=
> close all the windows.
>
> > There are aspects that are work in progress- the star ratings you see
> > will appear as just 1 star with a dropdown to represent the 5, and the
> > media controls are not the finished article to name a couple- again,
> > hit me with suggestions on this one, either on list or PM
>
> > The screenshots can be found here- this is the YourView classifier
> > (where the tagging takes place) :
>
> >http://yourview.tv/images/YourViewplayer.tiff
>
> Well, there isn't anything that seems out of the ordinary here.
=A0Except
> that we don't see where the menu is.
>
> The hard part is that the Mac experience is not only a particular visual
> look, but a method of operation that is in many ways different from
> windows. =A0Some of these differences are rather subtle, so you might
not
> even think of them at first. =A0For example, on a Mac, you can open
> do***ents in a program (running or not) by dragging them to an icon on
> the dock. =A0In windows, you can't drop do***ents on task bar tabs, you
> have to actually drag them onto an open window of the application.
>
> On Macs many things are moved by dragging and (except for text), not by
> cut-and-paste. =A0This is particularly true of moving or copying files.
> The copy-and-paste method from Windows seems really foreign to me as a
> Mac user.
>
> Mac users tend to work with more open windows at once. =A0On windows,
the
> use of full-screen windows is more common.
>
> Finally, you should avoid, as much as possible, the use of modal
> dialogs. =A0This is not really a Mac-specific thing, but non-modal
dialogs=
> are much friendlier from a user perspective than modal dialogs. =A0They
> are harder to implement, but users like them better.
>
> I would also make sure to look at the Human Interface Guidelines from
> Apple:
>
>
<http://developer.apple.com/do***entation/UserExperience/Conceptual/OS...>=
>
> and I would also recommend reading some of Bruce Tognazzini's columns:
>
> <http://www.asktog.com/>
>
> --
> Thomas A. Russ, =A0USC/Information Sciences Institute- Hide quoted text
-
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thomas,
Thanks for your contribution, that is extremely helpful and sound
advice. The look and feel of something that can sell into the Mac
market is one thing, but its certainly
> The hard part is that the Mac experience is not only a particular visual
> look, but a method of operation that is in many ways different from
> windows.
the method of operation that has as much of an impact, and something
that needs work on in some aspects of YourView. The fact it is written
in Java and looks like a Windows product is of prominent im****tance to
us as we'd like it to become as comparable as possible to the
competition, most of which is written in Cocoa. The commercial
decision on whether or not to make the step into Cocoa then becomes an
easier one to make.
> Well, there isn't anything that seems out of the ordinary here. Except
> that we don't see where the menu is.
What type of Mac products that use a menu style do you think are worth
looking at? And do you have any tips for helping to bring what we have
appearance wise closer to the demands of the market?
Thanks for your input, much appreciated.
Matthew
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