On 9 Apr., 13:33, Friedrich Dominicus <just-for-news-fr...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> Well I do not have to check that but it does now show why the users
> have broken it, you wrote Uwe wants to make a GUI toolkit but the base
> tools was changed which broke their code. So what have this "users"
> done to break Eiffel?
Well the problem was always that Colnet had a fellowship or users
(mostly
current or former students) and that users were putting to less
attention to the
situation. There was also no pressure from users/customers to force
the
developer into a direction (well at least not officially - i'm not
sure why
Meyer turned 180=B0 in his opinions - maybe there was a lot behind the
scenes).
I can only tell about the developments in the cost-free eiffel world
at these
days. And there wasn't any communication. I remember this crazy
russian guy
who rewrote the FOX GUI library tens of thousands of lines before
asking about
this project on either the FOX or the Eiffel lists.
No coordination and absolutely no focus on what's important.
For example getting a fucking "seek" and "tell" into the library of
Mr. Crazy
Colnets Compiler.
And spending a year or so to define the STRING class on NICE. Help,
Monsters
from a brainless planet took over earth or at least some parts of
France.
> there on Eiffel as Language was history. Not because that was a bad
> move but because not every Eiffel has got them. And well too all
> Eiffelists before ETL II was the "standard Eiffel" but we do not have
> this Standard any longer.
Plus the agent chapter from ETL III was badly written and so
SmartEiffel Agents
are still different from ISE Eiffel ones. Well the other vendors? You
know
that Visual Eiffel and Halstenbach died in this days, so hard to say
but
all Eiffel Systems (both of them) had agents.
> found in the computer business. The library just "works". And if
> nothing else from Eiffel ever will be remembered. I for my part think
> that the libraries were the best ever developed. And they are the
> easiest to understand IMHO.
Sure but it is an extremely small library. It still is. Look at the
standart
libraries of all projects. Where are POP3, SMTP, IMAP where Report/PDF
generation,
GUI, Databases, Statistiks, Networking, Crypto....
You see: Gobo was never more then a better standard library. It still
is not really
much more plus a few tools plus XML and a non useable memory eating
XSLT.
(By the way XML/XSLT hype is over).
> got choices. today it is reduced to more or less
> MSVC, Eclipse, gcc, gdb.
Well you forget NetBeans. But then we are really close to what is
there.
> And the tool situaion on commercial unices is even worse (hard to
> believe but try to get a decent IDE running under AIX). The things the
> Unix vendors have tried have just vanished (who the hell knows why it
> is named KDE?)
Yes. But the whole situation on commerical unices is worse. Not just
the
tool situation. With 50000 AIX installations worldwide you can't do
anything great.
We can discuss how this come.
[ ] Is it a consequence of the technical
brilliance of C++/Java/C# and Eclipse/Netbeans?
[x] Is it the consequence of free software that kills competition
and lead to cost free monopolized markets?
[ ] Is it because tool development is so expensive that
there is no other way?
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